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Get Stoked
09-04-2008, 09:15 PM
This is my first post of many posts that will be posted during the campaign for president. I'll try to be as unbiased as possible, which is hard in politics, but I will say I am a registered Democrat. I will talk about everything in these blogs. This one is an introductory to Sarah and John, soon I will do one for Obama and Bieden.

Right now I'm watching John McCain's speech (like to keep an open mind, but I was 100% sure I would agree on nothing he said tonight.)

Now, this isn't a bash-republican-blog, just basically to discuss what's going on between what we've heard from the republicans so far. Now, I have yet to hear anything I agree with or appreciate from John or Sarah, so I can only talk about the bad things. I will encourage you guys to post any good things you can find or have heard...

Sarah Palin: I thought it was pretty obvious from the day they announced her candidacy for Vice President that she was a tool, a republican tool. Not like a frat-boy term, "tool" but an actual tool for the republican party. It's obvious she is there to bring in Hillary Clinton voters who won't vote for Barack and to make the Republican party seem a little more open-minded and accepting. That's my take on her presence so far.

If you didn't know she was under investigation in her home state of Alaska for some pretty serious infractions, you should read up on this: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/04/palin.investigation/?iref=mpstoryview

Overall, I think she's 50/50 bad choice/good choice. Good choice in a devious way and bad choice because of her ongoing investigation and overall inexperience with Washington. I could go on forever about her issues, but those may come in future blogs.

John McCain: First, I think it's great that he's been in the military and has stuck with America through the Prisoner of War situation, etc... I do think that the republican party is relying way too much on that fact though. Every minute there's a plug about his service in the military and his POW situation and there's a serious lack of actual facts and full-proof plans that ensure he will be a good president. Just because you were in the military does not mean you are a good person, a good president, or a good American.

Also, his wife wore a 300,000 dollar dress to one of their speeches... 300,000 DOLLARS, that could buy everyone in my neighborhood groceries for a year! The McCain's also own 9 homes... 9! Then tonight during his speech, he says he's going to get rid of those big spending republicans in Washington who care about themselves first and America second... HE IS ONE OF THEM.

I'm going to cut this blog a little shorter, maybe when I'm not watching his lies on TV and typing at the same time, I can be a little more respectful and clear.

One last thing I will mention that I absolutely hate about Sarah and John is their recent disrespect to Community Organizers (people who help the community from Katrina Relief to Plowing Snow in Maine for old people's driveways.) The republicans, on numerous occasions now have said things like: "...community organizers are kind of like small town mayors, except small town mayors have real responsibilities."-Sarah Palin

"Community Organizer? (laugh) That's the first problem I see on Barack Obama's resume."-Rudy Gulliani

I'm going to end this one now, getting too heated.

Please, discuss and let me know if you have any questions. Next blog will maybe refresh you guys on some current Republican issues and also go over my opinions of Joe Bieden and Barack Obama.

Hitmanx123
09-04-2008, 09:48 PM
simply put, replublicans are poop stains that need to be washed out

Get Stoked
09-04-2008, 09:56 PM
I hope everyone who's 18+ and lives in America will be out voting in the election!

Hitmanx123
09-04-2008, 10:04 PM
well i turn 17 next year sooo....yeah lol still a ways to go

lookingforgold
09-05-2008, 01:18 AM
mcain is old and palin is abitch.

in my rpesent state i would like to say that your political system is totall yfucked up and makes no sense whatsoever.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 09:41 AM
Yeah, it seems like an MTV reality show right now... it's pathetic.

I wish I lived in Canada.

SonicKaos
09-05-2008, 10:10 AM
Yea Canada!!

Yea.. that's all I have to contribute to this topic at the moment....

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 11:35 AM
wow, a lot of dumb-ocrats here.....aka pansies and tree-huggers


shame......


and yes i will be voting, and i'm a registered republican......



and stoked, when you bring up things as unimportant as how much her dress cost you only make yourself sound envious.......anyone that can afford 9 homes and 300,000 dollar dresses should flaunt them as often as they like......


i swear, most democrats would be happier if they were communists.....but most don't know what true communism is.....



ps. obama couldn't preside over student council at a daycare....

AceMcCloud
09-05-2008, 11:53 AM
I watched Sarah Palin's speech the other night. How can she go up there and not so much as utter the words "education" or "economy?":confused:

And her son's name is TRACK!


Don't you think that if you can afford 9 homes, then you could also handle paying higher taxes? Instead of the people who can't afford 1 home paying them for you?

And her son's legal birth name is TRACK!!!

Corrine
09-05-2008, 12:25 PM
Track, really? That's fantastic.

I should pay more attention to US politics, especially as we have a 'special relationship' from when Thatcher allowed US cruise missiles on British soil making us a legitimate target for Russia.

Anywhoo.... Sarah Palin looks like Karen Walker from Will & Grace.

http://www.dollymix.tv/karenwalker.jpg

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 12:26 PM
no ace, i don't think if someone owns 9 homes that they should have to pony up more money....



i don't know how old you are but, if you and your friends buy a case of beer or two, do you decide how much to chip in by what everyone makes? no, that's ludicrous.....


it's not their fault poor people can't pull their own weight....


maybe if government programs rewarded saving instead of seeing it as an excuse to decrease that programs budget, we wouldn't need as much of the rich peoples money......think about that.....

KushKrashBOOM
09-05-2008, 01:20 PM
you are a fucking idiot if you vote McCain
fucking
idiot
i
d
i
o
t

i really cant see how people can be undecided!
and i agree with Stoked that Sarah Palin is a complete tool for pathetic women who only want to see a woman in power with no thought on how they will effect the country

last year my school did this thing (im not 18+ btw) where we were given a list of numbers
each number stood for a president hopeful but we were not told who that number represented
beforehand all the stupid girls of course wanted hillary
we were given the details of what each president hopeful would plan to do and all that and that
NOONE in the class in the end picked hillarys number...
90 percent obama and the rest some republican
and again after seeing the results all the girls still said they would have voted hillary either way
its fucking idiots that have voted stupidly and have caused this country to become what it has become

so im pro obama
and i swear if this country chooses mccain...
im done with this country

but if obama doesnt live up to what hes saying fuck him too
we cant stand for that shit anymore

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpXVN-Qfr2A&feature=related

KushKrashBOOM
09-05-2008, 01:24 PM
"just after world war 2.....
they say that they were the greatest generation
and i'm not so sure...

i'm not so sure!?

i think potentially this be the greatest generation right here!

cause right now this fuckin' government took this country to war for a lie to spare this empire and millions of you across this country and said no!
stood up and said no!

and with the whole world watching!
this generation here! of this country!
we have to step up!
we have to step up!
we have taken the concert stage!
and the crowd that enters the streets!
and we won't let these fascists rule us any longer!
this generation!

Are you standing in line?
Are you believing the lie?
You bow down to the flag?
You have a bullet in your fucking head!"

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 01:31 PM
or it's because i agree more with mccain's platform.....


i'm glad idealistic children like you can't vote yet.....i hope you learn some things about life before you turn 18...get some perspective


all good, the truth is democrats hand you a bunch of garbage ass fairy tales and they sound all sugary sweet but by the time they start screwing the country over and the side effects are taking place, someone else is in office so it gets blamed on them.....


this country has short term memory and loves hearing silly stories about saving trees and screwin over people wealthier than themselves.....

Corrine
09-05-2008, 01:41 PM
I'm concerned that Sarah Palin believes that global warming is not man made, her stance on abortion is equally worrying, if I was raped I'd have to give birth to my rapist's child according to her.

KushKrashBOOM
09-05-2008, 01:42 PM
ok so tryin to keep this a little civilized i guess...

tell me what about mccains platform makes you prefer his than anyone elses??

and seriously the age comment
lame...
predictable...
unnecessary...

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 02:31 PM
Yeah, in the blog I asked to keep it respectful and if you disagreed to state what you agree with from McCain/Palin.

You realize Emmit that McCain and Palin don't make taxes even across the board, they lower them for people with more money and raise them for people with less. Does that make sense? It makes none... Rich get richer, poor get poorer. The only people that are getting tax cuts from McCain and Palin are people who make over 200,000 a year... I make like 30,000 a year at the most, but for some reason I have to pay more taxes and can't afford health insurance... What's up with that?

All these things you hear McCain and Palin say about Democrats wanting to not drill at all and to jump straight out of the war is a LIE. We want to drill, but we just don't want to rely fully on drilling. We can invest in wind energy and solar energy, alternative fuels, etc... while drilling what we need until we're more advanced in what alternatives we have.

Emmit, do you agree with what George W. Bush jr. has done over the past 8 years? If you do, then there's probably no hope it getting you to realize there is a real problem. If you don't like George, then I have no clue why you are voting for McCain. It's the same party, same rules... McCain voted WITH George W. Bush jr. on 90% of the issues they voted on.

I just don't understand how people can side with liers who only care about themselves...

I don't want lobbyists running my country, if McCain/Palin gets into office this time around, I will be leaving the country.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 02:34 PM
I'm concerned that Sarah Palin believes that global warming is not man made, her stance on abortion is equally worrying, if I was raped I'd have to give birth to my rapist's child according to her.

Two very good points.

I think that part of what we see is global warming is just nature taking it's course, but there's no doubt we're helping speed the process along heavily. America is a very big producer of pollution, if we did our part, we would show others how to live healthier and also take a massive chunk of pollution away.

As for abortion, you make a great point. Palin also wants to enforce abstinence in public schools, but she doesn't want to have sex education. That worked out well for her right? Her 17 year old is pregnant...

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 02:39 PM
or it's because i agree more with mccain's platform.....


i'm glad idealistic children like you can't vote yet.....i hope you learn some things about life before you turn 18...get some perspective


all good, the truth is democrats hand you a bunch of garbage ass fairy tales and they sound all sugary sweet but by the time they start screwing the country over and the side effects are taking place, someone else is in office so it gets blamed on them.....


this country has short term memory and loves hearing silly stories about saving trees and screwin over people wealthier than themselves.....

Sorry for the triple post, but i'm not spamming, haha.

Anyways, if we look at our country's state before Bush's presidency, when Clinton was in office, we see that we were not in debt, crime was down, there were a ton more jobs than current, and the economy was in great shape. Clinton is and was a democrat...

Now, look at what Bush has done to what Clinton had built... Bush, living to the stereotypical neo-republican guidelines. Now it has ruined our economy, lost al lot of our jobs, lost al lot of our nurses and teachers, crime is much higher, and we're borrowing money from CHINA! We're billions and billions and billions of dollars in debt. We spend 10 billion dollars a MONTH on the war in iraq, that's money we don't have to be rebuilding a country that's not our own.

Do you not see the problem? I'm not saying Democrats are perfect, but they are the obvious choice during this election. We need to get back on our feet!

KushKrashBOOM
09-05-2008, 02:51 PM
yea good points stoked
still... if mccain wins im leaving the country when im done with school...
lol i plan to leave anyway but mccains election will only influence me more so

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 04:14 PM
First of all Kush, it's not McCain or "anyone else's", it's Obama....there is no one else to vote for.....

but i like that McCain is in favor of us running our own social security accounts, he supports regulations to protect our privacy on and off-line, he supports immigration reform, he also supports tax credits to small businesses to offset insurance costs.....

and stoked:
"You realize Emmit that McCain and Palin don't make taxes even across the board, they lower them for people with more money and raise them for people with less. Does that make sense?" yes, that's what i've been saying....the rich already pay a sum that is far more than yours.....how does this not make sense....? why should they have to contribute more to the kitty?

also, comparing someone to bush is awful.....

i don't love mccain, i just agree with more of his platform than obama's....a lot more.....

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 04:38 PM
You know, there's no way to tell if the president will actually be able to put what they say they will do, through. I just know that the democrats have almost always stuck to their word.


I do know that the republicans are big on the rich and the people who benefit them and at this current time, we need to take care of ourselves, not the rich folks wallets.

Corrine
09-05-2008, 04:54 PM
Politicians regardless of their political stand point, will say anything to get elected. One of the cornerstones of Tony Blair's election promises was 'Education, education, education' CODSWALLOP (pardon my language) English schools are pretty much fecked, with teachers tied up by needless beauracracy which naturally leads to a poorer standard of teaching.

Though all of Britain's ills can be traced back to Thatcher who privatised national industries, created a boom or bust economy and generally fecked the country up. but whats this got to do with the US I hear you ask?

Right wing politics is right wing politics regardless of whether it's Republican or Tory.

I'll have no truck with a government that keeps the poor down whilst increasing the wealth of the elite.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 05:17 PM
"we need to take care of ourselves"

are we not all americans?

do you consider yourself more important than the rich?
then why should we get preferential treatment?

the middle and lower class don't need to be coddled, all classes need to be treated equally.....this is america....not the economic special olympics

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 05:25 PM
"we need to take care of ourselves"

are we not all americans?

do you consider yourself more important than the rich?
then why should we get preferential treatment?

the middle and lower class don't need to be coddled, all classes need to be treated equally.....this is america....not the economic special olympics

You can say the same thing to the republican's ways of benefiting the rich.

Are they better than the poor? No. Are we more important because we're poor? Somewhat... we can't afford health care to get what possibly could be cancer checked out, to help get our kids illnesses treated. I can barely afford college and am honestly having to think about quitting so I can pay mortgage and car insurance.

Obviously the poor are suffering, our communities are suffering, and there's no reason we shouldn't get some tax cuts based on our income. I mean, it is the governments choice to pay us less and tax us more at work. We don't get to choose what our taxes go towards either... My money is funding a war I don't agree with.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 05:35 PM
"You can say the same thing to the republican's ways of benefiting the rich."

no you can't and that's what i'm telling you......they just want the rich to be treated more fairly......again i ask, only in different terms, "if entrance into the skatepark is $15 (taxes), why should the rich have to pay an exorbitant amount more?"
taxes need restructuring, percentages add up quickly when you have more money.....it's not fair, they are humans competing in the same race as us, stop trying to hold their shirts and tie their laces together......they're ahead and doing that isn't going to change that......

it's like in gran turismo when you turn on the option to boost the player's car that's losing......kind of unsporting, eh? not cricket in my book.....


ps. you won't get to choose where your money goes if you vote obama either...in case you weren't aware....

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 05:43 PM
That's a completely different situation.

You're not answering my question though... why do the poor have to pay more taxes while the rich oil companies and lobbists get tax breaks for their own personal benefit?

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 05:45 PM
ps. you won't get to choose where your money goes if you vote obama either...in case you weren't aware....

Btw, I know this, but I do know that my money will be going towards things I agree with and if there's an absolute outcry from the American people to not do something, like invade a country for no reason at all, then he will listen to us because he's there for us, not lobbyists and oil companies.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 05:47 PM
i am answering your question and you aren't understanding me.....



they don't.......the dollar amount that you pay is less than the dollar amount most wealthy people pay......why do you (and myself included) get a free ride on their dime?

i'm not saying increase OUR taxes....i'm just saying that breaks for them are well in order and overdue.....it's only fair.....you're the one asking to be treated special....

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 05:55 PM
The dollar amount that wealthy people pay is way more yes, but we're still not paying the same percentage.

For instance, If I pay 15 percent state income tax while some tobacco company from pays 10 percent. They're paying more money, because they make more, but it's not effecting their budget the same way as it does mine.

If I can't go out and have a nice dinner over the weekend because I have a 15 percent tax then jo-schmo with the tobacco company shouldn't be able to purchase 12 of the restaurants I would have eaten at.

Do you understand? It's not fair.

I do ask for a break on us though, if we don't get a break, then they should raise minimum wage because us poor people work hourly... most rich people don't, they get salary and hourly wages do not effect their salary.

If big companies and lobbyists are going to get a tax cut, then their taxes should go towards things like: Rebuilding New Orleans, researching alternative energy, curing cancer, etc...

Exxon Mobil just had the largest recorded fiscal year profit in the history of the WORLD and they got TAX BREAKS. None of that money went to their workers, none of that money went to anything beneficial, it went to the owners and share holders to buy useless materialistic crap like a 300,000 dollar dress or 9 homes.

Sure, I would like to be able to purchase a home or two, but not 9, 500,000$+ homes scattered all over the U.S. If I had that much money, I would donate it or give it to family.

Republicans are greedy and care about themselves, at least the ones in Washington and if there are some that don't, they're probably not appreciated by the, "real republicans."

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 06:09 PM
I'm saying a percentage is unfair to begin with. Why should they pay a percentage to live here? They are only one person.

Perhaps, since this is a capitalistic society, a percentage tax on CORPORATIONS is fair. They conduct business so tax the profit they get from said business,.

but...

To tax a normal citizen more actual dollars for the same citizenship is unamerican and i don't approve.

The job market is the same for everyone....if you don't make enough money, do something to change your situation, the wealthy did.



Furthermore, why do you call them greedy?


Why should loving money be treated any differently than loving another human being? You'd give it to charity, they'd give it to themselves....none is more noble. Just two different choices.

Corrine
09-05-2008, 06:35 PM
Furthermore, why do you call them greedy?


Why should loving money be treated any differently than loving another human being? You'd give it to charity, they'd give it to themselves....none is more noble. Just two different choices.

I find it hard to reconcile a mother having enough baby formula to feed her child against someone buying some hand stitched Gucci loafers.

Further to that whilst the rich are taxed, they can afford 'creative' accountants who will shift money around to ensure that their client is not paying the full amount on their capital.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 06:36 PM
So, while a kid dies of cancer and his parents can't pay for the bills so treatment is not given, a rich guy goes out and buys a Ferrari, knowing that kid is going to die.

Is that right, morally? No.

Sure, I'd love money if everyone else had money, but they don't. Money is the root of all evil... there's no way to love that.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 06:49 PM
"they can afford 'creative' accountants"
so? it's not illegal...and when it is, people go to jail, what's the problem?
if you can't afford an accountant, you don't get one and thusly don't reap the benefits of an accountant. They paid for one and shall recieve the benefit.







And the kid with cancer thing? c'mon. that's absolutely ridiculous to say that everyone else should pay for each others problems. i don't have an x-box 360, are you going to buy me one?

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 07:04 PM
Having cancer and wanting an Xbox are like fire and ice.

You seriously need to rethink your stance on life.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 07:41 PM
c'mon man, it's just a political stance.
i'm not telling you you're wrong, just stating my opinion.

kind of a "fair across the board" stance.


all gravy


ps. i don't judge people by their political views......ie. outside of this thread......people are too different...

SonicKaos
09-05-2008, 07:57 PM
Man have I ever been educated by reading this thread haha... too bad I can't vote in the US because I actually feel like it at the moment.

I have to say I'm very much with Stoked and the rest here though. Here's my oppinion:

The rich get to keep more of their money while the poor have to pay more... this much is true. Should someone who has worked hard to accumulate a large amount of money have to pay more taxes then someone who hasn't been able to? No. It's the fact that the government is taking a lower percentage from people who have a lot of money then they are from those who NEED all the money they can get to live.

If everyone could afford everything they need to live then there wouldn't be a problem. Rich people would have more money to spend on things they enjoy, while "poor" people would have to be a bit more conservative with their money by spending less cash on entertainment...and perhaps the rich deserve that luxury. However, there are a lot of people out there who as Stoked said cannot afford medicine, food, shelter, transportation or a lot of other things. Why do they have to pay a higher percentage then those who can afford such things and much more?

If a poor man and a rich man went to a skatepark that charged 10 dollars for admission, should the rich person pay more? No they shouldn't, because that's an activity done for personal pleasure. This is a service that people CHOOSE to use and therefore pay for, and has nothing to do with life or death. You don't CHOOSE to whether or not you pay for food, you need it to live... you don't CHOOSE whether you pay to cure your cancer, because if you don't you'll die. Finally, you don't CHOOSE to pay taxes, because you are forced to in order to live in this country.

If being poor meant you just couldn't do as many fun things, life would be fine. Making people pay a larger percent of their earned money BECAUSE they don't make as much is not.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 08:02 PM
c'mon man, it's just a political stance.
i'm not telling you you're wrong, just stating my opinion.

kind of a "fair across the board" stance.


all gravy


ps. i don't judge people by their political views......ie. outside of this thread......people are too different...

Well, I understand they're just political views.

Thinking that not being able to cure your cancer and wanting an Xbox 360 are in the same category, that's an issue.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 08:10 PM
Sonic, you CHOOSE whether to do well in school. You CHOOSE what field you go into. You CHOOSE your career. People CHOOSE to have children when they can't afford them. People CHOOSE to make sacrifices and risks to do well in business or otherwise...and they should be rewarded.


I don't understand the confusion.


and you're bringing up the percent again, why should it be a percentage?

when you bought your neon did you pay a percentage of your income for the neon? no, you paid a set price......why should a "tax" for living here be any different?


and stoked: if there's an issue it's on your end....i'm cool with your communist ass.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 08:37 PM
Emmit, that's what would happen IF you had an average life. If you GOT to go to school you could choose to pass, if you had the resources to get a job you COULD choose to do well...

That's not always the situation Emmit, this is what republicans don't understand. Not everyone is fortunate and not everyone can dig themselves out of a hole...

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 08:44 PM
i was born into and currently still have a less than average life (depending on your view of average) and still feel this way (it's my responsibility to change it, so i am)......unfortunately the situations we're born into we have to deal with....everything else is up to us.......survival of the fittest, man up

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 08:53 PM
Well, to each his own I guess.

It's not survival of the fittest in my opinion. I pay the government taxes, I am here in America as a tool for the draft if needed, I buy American products and damnit I deserve help when I need it.

I may have to quit school soon because I can't pay for it without sacrificing things I need to live like food, car insurance, or home... I need to be paid more or taxed less...

SonicKaos
09-05-2008, 10:11 PM
Well I don't exactly agree with that either... Not everyone has the skills to be a doctor and get paid the big bucks, and if everyone could then they wouldn't get paid much because their talent would be easy to find. People are just born naturally good at a few things, and those things aren't always the biggest money makers in the world. I personally could never be a doctor for various reasons, and I don't think going to school for it would help.

That brings up another point though. Sure you CAN choose your field of interest in school, but you can only pursue it if you can afford it. After highschool ends, the cost of school goes up a ton. Some people can afford it, some people have to take out large loans to go through it, and others can't go at all because they have no money.

Also, location is important too. If you went to school for Television and you live in the middle of nowhere, there aren't going to be a lot of career oppertunities available for you. If you manage to make your way to the top position of a local company, you still won't be making a ton of money. Someone who was fortunate enough to be born near hollywood, New York or any other large city will be doing the same job but making a lot more money.

The percentages are important because it's the way to measure how much to take from each person... Say you make $500 a week at your job, and the government takes 15% of that. That's $75 a week out of your pocket that you may need to buy important commodaties. Say a somewhat rich person is making 2000 a week, and the government taxes them 10%, just because they make a lot of money. They lose $200 a week to the government, which seems like more money, but if they weren't being treated specially BECAUSE they have more money, they'd be losing $300 instead at 15%. Now you've got a rich man with $1800 to pay his bills and go have fun, while the poor man has only $425. Does the rich dude care much because he's missing 200 dollars? Probably not, because he's got more then enough to live a nice life... but the person who only has 425 could use that 25 bucks to buy gas to get to his job.

The car thing is pretty much exactly the same as my other comment though. You don't NEED a car to survive, but you do need shelter to live in. A person could live without a car (and I know plenty of people who live just fine without vehicles) and save about $400 a month not paying insurance or gas cost.

There are a few things you need to live: Food, water and shelter. Everything else is technically a bonus. Rich people can afford these and more easily, and the tax cut makes it even easier on them. People who struggle to afford such nessessities need to keep every cent they can hold on to, so to tax them more for being poor is stupid.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 10:25 PM
For me, the closest gas station is about 7 miles away and the closest grocery store is about 5. I NEED a car for sure, I'm not skating on these one lane back roads at night, haha.

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 10:40 PM
People aren't being taxed for being poor.....i'm all for equal or the rich receiving something a little less than equal.....i just don't see why they should have to pay an equal "percentage of income".....when that makes it sooo far out of balance it's ridiculous......income shouldn't come into it at all.......why should that matter?


Sonic, if you apply yourself you CAN do something that will earn you enough money.....you need money to survive in the current human environment, and.......like i said, survival of the fittest. Then, it's what you do with the money that separates you from the rest.

Get Stoked
09-05-2008, 11:14 PM
Emmit, I understand what you're saying. I have come from having absolutely nothing... seriously, nothing at all.

I just opened a business with my girlfriend, having a house built (had to borrow money of course,) and am feeling pretty confident in my ability to make it. Now, say I get cancer or get paralyzed or something... my girlfriend and I are screwed for life...

Before you say anything, our mortgage will be cheaper than rent is anywhere around and we make about as much money in our business right now as we would working 50 hours a week at some random minimum wage-ish job. So, sacrifice we did not, we're actually decreasing how much we pay per month by taking risks... still, if something happens to one of us, there's no way for us to over come that without some type of help. Health Insuance... we can't afford it yet, the government should provide decent, affordable health care that's unbiased to lifestyles and current health...

That's all I'm saying for the night.

Thanks for the discussion, sure it will continue!

EmmitBrown
09-05-2008, 11:20 PM
you ARE making sacrifices.....in the form of inadequate healthcare.....i too am making that sacrifice...........you could be set with health AND life insurance so you both are chillin, but you'd rather have the money upfront....me too, i'm better with it than the government.......just because you're making sacrifices doesn't mean you should be making any certain sum of money.....that is contingent on your business savvy.....and btw, you have a 2002 subaru forrester, that costs money......perhaps it is more car than you can afford if you do not have health insurance......

switchFooTexas
09-05-2008, 11:24 PM
Without knowing much about politics whatso ever, you can all disregard this statement hah.

I would vote for McCain if i could. I believe that if we end up going into World War 3 which i believe could happen at anytime, all it takes is one small event to trigger it, McCain would be the better leader. He said he will not let Iraq become another Vietnam, to me atleast, Obama just doesn't seem to have to the experience to lead our country through a time of war. We need a good strong leader, not "change" or whatever that will lead to.

Just my 2 cents without any facts hah

SonicKaos
09-06-2008, 12:08 AM
Well, if the tax was just a certain amount everyone had to pay that'd be fine too, but it would have to be pretty low so that almost everyone could afford it. Percentages are pretty much just a way for the government to get more money out of people though, so a low amount from everyone would be like downgrading from where they're at now.

I'm not saying I can't do something that will make a lot of money though, because I know I can. I'm just saying that everyone has their talents that makes them more suited for specific jobs then others. I couldn't be a doctor because of my personality mainly, but I don't feel like I could withstand as much schooling as they need to learn about every type of sickness either. I used to want to be a programmer, but after going through some classes of it I realised that my brain just doesn't work that way. I suppose I could take a long time forcing myself to learn it, but I'm more of a creative type.

Survival of the fittest to me means that a lot of people would be screwed lol. Then again fitness and money smarts are quite different.

As for the war thing, i suppose that could technically happen at any time really. Iraq pretty much is already a Vietnam though, and I don't know how much of a war leader he could be considering he was in a POW camp for a lot of it lol.

EmmitBrown
09-06-2008, 07:29 AM
but that's the thing......


survival of the fittest is referring to the most fit for the environment.....


so in this day and age, the fittest have money smarts.....if they do not, they are not the fittest......


and all career paths are definitely not all of the same difficulty, i just mean that in america everyone does have the opportunity....for some it's just harder depending on what situation you were born into and personal abilities and aptitudes.....(i don't have the personality to be a waiter, let alone a doctor)


all good though, i enjoy a nice brain poking session.....


but it's raining on the east coast......so now i go skate.ing

Get Stoked
09-06-2008, 09:23 AM
This isn't survival of the fittest though.

Also, I think you guys need to be educated on Iraq a little more. Iraq does not and did not plan on having any weapons of mass destruction and Saddam Hussein did not (nor did Iraq in any way) have ties to Al Qaeda. Osama Bin Laden is still alive and HE'S NOT in Iraq, haha. What's the reason we are in Iraq? Do you know? I sure as hell don't.

Why are we borrowing billions of dollars from China? Why are we spending 10 Billion dollars a month on Iraq when our own country is has areas that are trashed and crime filled?

Now, of course we're in Iraq already, so we can't just pull out but what the Republicans are doing in this racing is making their supporters think Obama/Bieden plans on just pulling out... that's not it at all. They have a set plan to fix it and get out by a certain date. We do not need to stay there until atleast 2015 like McCain says... if he does keep us there until 2015, there will be a draft and you better believe everyone who's 18 plus by then on this forum and lives in America will go to Iraq and risk theirs lives for a bullshit cause.

The Iraqi people want us OUT, that's a fact, you guys shoud listen to NPR more often, very unbiased and they actually interview Iraqis and stuff, not some suit-wearing political genius who gets paid to lie.

As for my Subaru, it was 6,000 dollars and I've had it for a few years now. It's much cheaper to buy a newish, reliable car than a junker that'll cost 6,000 to fix/replace over time.

EmmitBrown
09-07-2008, 06:13 AM
I never brought up iraq......so......i'll assume you weren't talking to me....

In any event, we're a capitalistic society, and in a capitalistic society it's survival of the fittest, economically speaking. Everything evens itself out with little or no interference from the government......when we get interference from the government concerning business matters, it only makes other problems.

As far as NPR, they aren't as unbiased as you think....but NPR is good if you like to hear friendly hippie anti-corporation stories......everyone is biased at least somewhat......there are stories they could run that show the faults and end results of democrat-esque "missions" but they don't......because the aren't in that mindset......

They're a lot less biased than a channel like Fox however.



also, you should learn to take things with a grain of salt instead of just assuming that everyone in a suit is lying.....because that isn't the case and not giving people a chance to make a point because they have a different agenda than you is just as bad as them lying....



"Why are we spending 10 Billion dollars a month on Iraq when our own country is has areas that are trashed and crime filled?"

well put bluntly, because money is power and people with money realize it is in their best interests to keep people that live in areas that are "crime filled and trashed" living in those conditions......i thought everyone knew that....unfortunately the only way to change that is to obtain money and influence, and put a well thought out plan in motion.....it's a part of a system, so changing the one aspect will have an effect on the rest of the system......that's what someone's plan will have to deal with.......the entire system......

AceMcCloud
09-12-2008, 12:32 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html

Visual of Obama vs Mccain tax plan.

How does Mccain's make any sense?

I don't know anyone who makes hundreds of thousands of dollars a year...

EmmitBrown
09-12-2008, 01:31 PM
the better question is "how does obama's?"

Get Stoked
09-12-2008, 02:45 PM
I can't believe after looking at that graph, you can't say that Obama's plan is better...


Obama's = The rich stay rich, the less wealthy aren't as pressured.

McCain = The rich get richer, the poor get poorer.

Why should rich people get more money? The poor shouldn't have to pay more... that's bs.

There's no way to reason with your view on this apparently... the above is my opinion and should display that way I'll be voting.